hmmmmmmmmm……interesting

Damn being first, this guy really bothers me, referring to his own people as them.Trust me when white people look at you, you are a “them”. He is so blind to reality

thought i was first afafas

LMAO @ this useless self-hater. He is confused and deluded and deserves no recognition, attention or respect.

“McWhorter had no interest in sports as a child, preferring to stay in the house reading, playing the piano or listening to his Spanish language records.”………..he is clearly also down low.

All my love,

Mary xx

maybe you should learn proper grammar before you put an intelligent man on blast

does he know that he is “them”? the white man would still hang his ass! brainwashing at it’s best

He is a GAY loser!! I have no problem with BLACK SCHOLARS, but what use is being a Scholar when you lack COMMON SENSE?

His statements are so ignorant and basically iterating on the white stereotypical concept of blacks. For a guy staying in his house listening to Liberacci, he sure knows about black people..

This down Low Batty man should get a Plunger up his ass and he’ll know just who “THEM” is.. Why wasn’t this COON in Birmingham in their hayday? I HATE THESE HOUSE N*GG*RS!!!

Where is the KKK when they are really needed??

“‘we’ were not like ‘them,’”

It is typical of the black bourgeoisie to use a white standard of measurement to determine worth. Well Mr. McWhorter, if you are not like them then who are you like? The answer is surely the one that affirms white culture.

Moreover, one of the things that reveal these type of conservative black scholars are myopic and subtly controlled by an ideological, white normative gaze is the fact that they always take the point of view opposite to the predominate black constituency. Whether the nooses were a prank or not the subsequent events of the case in Jena reveal problems in the justice system in America.

i wish those boys would pull a prank on his worthless ass.

he’s fox news’ puppet. what a waste.

He reminds me of that bytch Sandra Rose who is a black blogger and believes they got what they deserved. No one ever visit her site again. Please

OOHHH, i Get it, so he was hidden from his own heritage when he was a child and now thinks he has a right to say something about something he knows nothing about. Jeese its clear now, why didnt u guys just say this in the first place!

John McWhorter, is intelligent but lacks common sense and is socially deprived.

I feel sorry for him because, his comments and shared views are obviously geniune. This man really believes that the Jena 6 nooses were a prank…I’m sorry but I blame his parents. For them to deprive their child from knowledge about his own racial background is just sad.

There is nothing wrong with being a Black person…but there is something wrong with ignorance.

We may not always agree with other People’s views but they must be allowed to express them! There is no need to perpetuate the myth that Black people are a neat homogeneus group they are not and some people hold different views about the i nterpretation of that event which may not be palatable but should be supported to express their views.

Whatever, all it takes is for him to be put in his place then he will be running back to “them”. Sure it was a prank, and those thousands of black people killed were just pranks too.

You’re one spelling and grammar-challenged stupid hater. You’re criticizing the man for being stereotypical and lacking common sense, yet you assume that he’s gay partly because of his interests in classical music? Huh? You suggest that a plunger be stuck up his ass by racists because he has beliefs that you don’t like. What? Just DUMB.

Also, the words you meant to use are spelled “Liberace” and “heyday.” No need to thank me

Why is he still alive?

scholar? for what? writing thesis papers?

this is the most ignorant sh*t i have ever heard.

and I guess the Klu Klux Klan were killing and terrorizing black folks for kicks?

PEOPLE, DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE HATE. THOSE NOOSES WERE SYMBOLIC OF THE HATE THAT IS CLEARLY STILL EXISTING.

Ummm I hope you are not referring to “hanged”

Lol.

It’s sad because there are quite a few people down there in Jena that believe the same thing and they are black…To them its like stay in your place and play they part and the white people wont bother you…and when something happens to a black man they feel like well he shouldve stayed in his place and kept his mouth shut..sad that some people still have that slave mentality…as long as nothing is happening to them they are ok.

Jesus needs to take the wheel NOW@!!!

it’s one thing not to agree with what mr. mcwhorter stated. it is entirely another to be so myopic as to insult this man to this degree. personally, i don’t believe this noose incident was an innocent prank. however, it troubles me tremendously that in this day and age so many people buy into this idea of a monolithic viewpoint of authentic blackness. read the man’s books and then decide for yourself. think more critically. it saddens me that when some blacks don’t agree with one person’s opinion they are condemned so harshly and quickly. there are some points on which i disagree with mr. mcwhorter with vehemently. that’s okay, no need for name calling. meanwhile he is actually right on the money with a lot of theories. it’s not pretty but it is fast becoming the rule rather than the exception in this country the things he speaks about. it’s interesting and surprising the things you could learn from people you’ve been taught/programmed to dismiss. after all it’s just one man’s opinion and experience. so why the fuss? it’s as real as any of ours despite what has been marketed to you courtesy of BET. lastly, where does sexual orientation(or rather speculation) come into play here? why is this the ultimate insult for a black man. are gay men not real men, worthy and deserving of love, care, and respect from the so called black community.

This is the reason why we should ALL send our monetary support to:

Jena 6 Defense Fund

PO Box 2798

Jena, LA 71342

I think I’ve made my point…I’m out. Have a great evening all!!!

The short answer to your question, islandgirl, is “No.” The question back to you would be, “Why is that if black folks don’t agree with or just plain hate a clear and obvious sellout/tom/whoopi/cuba/clarence thomas, that they have to be “programmed?” Surely you’re not stating that McWhorter’s position is the one of the learned and everyone else’s is that of the ignorant… or are you?

brightseabully, I don’t think that’s what islandgirl is saying. I think she’s just saying that McWhorter gets a lot of flack because he’s, for the most part, right wing, and most blacks fall in step with the left. So to deviate from the status quo prompts ridicule, like, racist ridicule at that, because typically, it’s usually only blacks that are referred to as toms and sell outs. I’m not a lawyer, but I wonder what far reaching implications this Jena case will have on the fate of noose hanging and whether or not noose hanging will go the way of most forms cross burning, in terms of being deemed illegal and what that means for first amendment rights. Cause when you think about it, the reason why the Supreme Court ruled against most forms of cross burning was because “KKK-type” cross burning was considered an act of terrorism. Now, be that as it may, could you interpret the Jena noose hanging as such? In declaring that the noose-hanging was a “prank”, McWhorter is saying that while the act itself was racist, that didn’t give those six black boys license to put that white boy (who had nothing to do with the noose hanging BTW),in the hospital, not that the act itself wasn’t racist, but now, if hanging nooses from trees in such a fashion isn’t just a “prank” but something done with the intent to terrorize, then what? . . .things to make you go, hmm

If you google this guy you will see that he writes a lot of misleading and negative things about blacks. However, the white media loves his ass because he tells them what they want to hear and affirms many of their racist & uninformed views about blacks.

How can you write so much about black people and hip hop after admiting you have nothing to do with blacks…. typical black republican!!

No you IGNORANT tool, I INFER that he is gay based on the fact that he looks like a little GIRL in the picture. I refer to Liberacci because he was gay and a piano player! I can spell Liberacci anyway I feel like!

Anywho, he looks like a fag and I stand by that.

I have no problems with black people that love classical music, but why do some people feel that if theyhave some education, they are somehow BETTER or different from the black peopson that maybe can’t afford classical music?

Clearly if this guy had a clue, he’d understand that charging 6 black boys for attempted murder is not only excessive, but the boys weren’t even adults.

meanwhile the white kids who beat up a black kid are suspended. I wonder what Ms. Liberacci thinks caused the difference in treatment?

He is a disgrace. Like I said, what use is being a scholar if you are a moron?? What use is book sense without common sense?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

LA CHICA is stupid

You’re one spelling and grammar-challenged stupid hater. You’re criticizing the man for being stereotypical and lacking common sense, yet you assume that he’s gay partly because of his interests in classical music? Huh? You suggest that a plunger be stuck up his ass by racists because he has beliefs that you don’t like. What? Just DUMB.

Also, the words you meant to use are spelled “Liberace” and “heyday.” No need to thank me

I get very passionate, so sorry for the typos!!

Did anyone actually read the article this quote came from ? Its actually attributed to Kathy Griffin and not JOHN McWHORTER.

snip:

The nooses, though, were a prank. Mean, but a prank. Humor and mischief are all about pushing the envelope: witness Kathy Griffin’s comments about Jesus at the Emmy Awards last week.

Read the full article folks, he goes on to say

http://www.nysun.com/pf.php?id=63055&v=6738950911

However, when white officials act upon a sense that what merits a slap on the hand for whites merits decades of confinement for blacks, they contribute to the fact that almost half of America’s prisoners are black. In stunting the lives of black men, they help create fatherless communities with young boys on their way to becoming statistics themselves. Furthermore, they feed the defeatist ideology that cherishes decrying racism over teaching black people how to thrive in an imperfect but negotiable world.

To the extent that black men do commit a disproportionate number of violent crimes, this is largely connected to the War on Drugs, and I have argued in a previous column that we need to re-evaluate the criminalization of drug possession and sale, which has been no more successful than Prohibition.

But meanwhile, moves to put away black teens for mere misbehavior for long spells no one would even consider for white teens must be condemned, loudly. For the sake of black communities, and to chip away at the sense that the American establishment views black men as inherently reprehensible.

To the Jena protesters today, then, please make noise.

Nowhere is anything mentioned about the individual who was attacked! Blacks condone violence, don’t they? A person was beaten and it’s OK????? The racists Jesse Jackson and Sharpton are there to protest what exactly? They are men of God???? They care nothing about anything but blacks! They make me sick!

“Maybe if they hanged his ass, that would be a prank too.”

THAT HAD ME ROLLING ON MY FLOOR!

Some ppl never seem to amaze me, this guy needs to seriously open his eyes.

to OMG..

Here’s a little knowledge for you…people are not condoning the fight…nobody is saying that the boys fighting were right to do that, but should they be charged attempted murder…A set of white boys jumped a black boy in Jena and they simply got suspended…no charges and went right back to school after the suspension…Did you know the white boy the Jena 6 jumped brought a shotgun to school?…and all they did was suspend him…Now this is a firearm on school grounds think columbine, think va tech, how did any1 not know that this guy wasnt gonna try it too yet he only got suspended…These Jena 6 boys are being charge for atempted murder on a boy that left the hospital with a black eye and attended a function that same night….I condone violence, but I condone fairness and in this case…Nothing is fair. These boys lives are tainted forever and all the white boys that jumped and briong guns to school are back in school chillin.

meant to say DONT condone violence*

brightseatbully

The short answer to your question, islandgirl, is “No.” The question back to you would be, “Why is that if black folks don’t agree with or just plain hate a clear and obvious sellout/tom/whoopi/cuba/clarence thomas, that they have to be “programmed?” Surely you’re not stating that McWhorter’s position is the one of the learned and everyone else’s is that of the ignorant… or are you?

”””””””””””””””””””””””’

Bully you are truly living up to your name. Your reasoning is ridiculous…You are casting a very wide net when you call all those people a “sellout.” What is a sellout anyway? To me a sellout is someone who refuses to live up to their great GOD given potential by keeping themselves down and out, refusing to study and get a proper education, sounding like they can’t string two words together, and punctuating their sentences with phrases like “you know what I mean.” (No,actually, I don’t)

I may not be a conservative, but I think it is hideous to assume that no black person should be a conservative. ISLAND GIRL makes a very persuasive statement. This guy calls the actions of the white students a prank. I do not agree, but I doubt the Jena 6 are as innocent as you may think. I do not have enough facts about them to make any kind of definitive statement, but I certainly am not wearing black OR sending any kind of check to these people…and why on earth does a kid have two battery convictions against him at that age anyway?

Another point-I prefer a man who is gay and admits it and does not try to hide who he really is, unlike some of these so called “down low” men. He has a right to be exactly who he is, and his words should not carry any less weight because of this. It is time to stop aiming so LOW, Black America..and stop blaming stuff on whites, even if it is REAL. The best revenge is proper education, proper careers, taking care of your health and staying fit, travelling and seeing the rest of the world, cleaning up the neighborhoods you live in and taking pride in yourself and your home. Stop giving your money to these silly places like “louis vuitton etc, speak properly and be respectful of others.

It behooves white America to have you think so lowly of yourselves that you aspire to NOTHING and ridicule those who choose not to live the way you do.

Actually blahblah, Marley is making a point about low expectations, a very passive and dangerous form of racism. Often it’s perpetuated by the people it targets,hmm. Since we are going off topic here I must say being from the ghetto is no excuse, for anything. Good, solid intelligent BLACK people from generations past have lived in squalid conditions that make public housing look like the bloody Four Seasons. It’s called having standards, not white standards or black standards, just standards and dignity. “You know what I mean?” Hint, it has nothing to do with speaking like Queen Elizabeth. Valley girl “culture” as you put it went out in the mid 80′s and was never an acceptable form of standard English either since you asked. Nor is the sloppy, dreadful, annoying pace those girls speak on The Hills, ugh… I digress. Racism may a part of American life, but it’s not 1864 or even 1964. People on this board, barring ideological differences, agree that the punishment here DOES NOT fit the crime. Ilish made a perfectly good point regarding the beating. The issue is not as black and white(pun intended) as it’s been made out to be. At the end of the day when the media hoopla has died down. Jesse, Al leave town. The people of Jena, LA still have to live with one another. There are lessons to be learned here. Invariably, there is a time to be angry and speak up in virulent protest. However there is also a time to open our eyes(and hearts) to what hurt has been inflicted on each other and start to heal in a meaningful way. Otherwise, I’m afraid these ugly situations and debates may continue to present themselves. Oh and bully, back off, you jump to conclusions with zero understanding of the heart of what I clearly pointed out. I sincerely hope these young men get a chance to see justice can work for them too, even if they weren’t complete saints in this whole debacle, just human. BTW, has anyone picked up support for the Dunbar Village incident? This is the story of a woman who needs financial and emotioanl support from justice seekers as well as the public outrage.

Marley is making a point about low expectations, a very passive and dangerous form of racism.

Low expectations is not racism. I suggest you pick up a dictionary of some sort.

Since we are going off topic here I must say being from the ghetto is no excuse, for anything. Good, solid intelligent BLACK people from generations past have lived in squalid conditions that make public housing look like the bloody Four Seasons.

Very simple thinking. People are often products of their environments. Paris Hilton for the same reason why the next man is poor. Kids with rich parents tend to die rich and poor kids with poor parents tend to die poor. There are always exceptions but generally that’s the way the world works.

It’s called having standards, not white standards or black standards, just standards and dignity.

Very simple thinking. Plenty of the richest most “educated” people in this world have little to no standards and/ or dignity. That dignity and standards stuff is all rubbish. We wish it was that simple as having dignity and standards, lol.

“You know what I mean?” Hint, it has nothing to do with speaking like Queen Elizabeth. Valley girl “culture” as you put it went out in the mid 80’s and was never an acceptable form of standard English either since you asked. Nor is the sloppy, dreadful, annoying pace those girls speak on The Hills, ugh…

I think you ought to go create your own world with Marley. That way you can create your own standards and don’t have to worry about tolerating others – you know the stuff that you preach about. And Valley girl culture did not go out. It’s still alive and well. Where have you been?

Racism may a part of American life, but it’s not 1864 or even 1964.

Silly people think racism was a thing of the past.

The issue is not as black and white(pun intended) as it’s been made out to be.

Say that when the blacks and the whites are punished equally. Until then, it’s a black and white issue.

I meant to type Paris Hilton is rich the same reason why the next man is poor.

huh?, okay you make nooo bloody sense again blah blah.

it’s not exactly “safe” to call another human being worthless no matter how you disagree with them. in fact, you have perhaps proven it “safe” to say that it is indeed you who is the idiot. is that a fair assumption of you? i sincerely hope it isn’t. doesn’t feel good to be generalized and insulted, does it? i await your bitter unintelligent response. not. by the way, who are you to tell someone about their assumed african-american heritage. he could be from anywhere. yawn. i’m done. this is clearly pointless. good day.

This is yet another sad case! For him or anyone else to justify the noose hangings as a prank is purely dilussional to say the least! I equate that act (and justifiably so) the same way as someone painting a swastika (sp)on a temple as being cowardly and barbaric. The symoblism ALONE is enough to make me vomit!

Another thought–

I think it’s grand that his parents raised him in a way that he would “broaden” his ways of thinking. At the same time I think it’s sad for him to feel the need to seperate the “us” and “them”. I went further into thinking maybe it wasn’t a black or white way of thinking (on his part). I think he meant socially separated. At least I hope so because at the end of the day, no matter how rich or poor, no matter your social status, no matter what color you marry, to some, we will always be ni**ers!

“FACT: One of the white students who beat up a black student only received probabation for his violent behavior.”

Just how badly was this white kid beaten? Does anyone know? Because that piece of info matters. From what I understand, none of the school yard fights, where whites were the aggressors, sent anyone to the emergency room, but the Jena 6 beating did. Kids getting into school yard brawls is nothing new, but it’s not everyday that some kid is hospitalized because of a school yard fight. I think attempted murder is an unreasonable conviction, but I do think that the punishment should fit the crime. I don’t know, aggravated assault and battery or something. Suspension from school is a typical punishment for fighting on school grounds, but when someone is injured as badly as this white kid supposedly was, then I could see why the police would have to get involved.

Okay. Let me me begin. My fellow Black people, This man’s chances of being hanged, beaten by white people will never happen.Why? BECAUSE HE ISN’T A THREAT!!! Surely, this is what White America needs.A Black man who does not oppose racist activities,but sugercoats them as an activity of a “prank” or to easily put it ” a naughty behavior.” This man is who every White person would want blacks to be. From the white Man’s perspective,” let’s not say anything, all we have to do is use their own race to go against them (Black people).” Now, let’s sit back and enjoy our scotch on the rocks.”

Fin

hes just mad sistas wont give him any…

Just how badly was this white kid beaten? Does anyone know? Because that piece of info matters. From what I understand, none of the school yard fights, where whites were the aggressors, sent anyone to the emergency room, but the Jena 6 beating did. Kids getting into school yard brawls is nothing new, but it’s not everyday that some kid is hospitalized because of a school yard fight. I think attempted murder is an unreasonable conviction, but I do think that the punishment should fit the crime. I don’t know, aggravated assault and battery or something. Suspension from school is a typical punishment for fighting on school grounds, but when someone is injured as badly as this white kid supposedly was, then I could see why the police would have to get involved.

This is true – A typical fight is different from sending someone to the hospital. But attempted murder and being tried as adult is fairly excessive and to me highlight the gross injustice in the system that I’m so very much against.

The police seemed to have been involved in all of the fights, including the one where the guy pulled the rifle. The minor who had the weapon was not charged, while the one who wrestled him for it was charged with multiple offenses.

Wow.

That’s a whole lotta self hate.

Jesus, be a dose of racial pride.

He didn’t black students in his book. He blasted black students who perpetuate the idea that learning is “white” and making moral choices isn’t cool and their parents for teaching them that. That’s not all black students.

Also, how would he know if it was a prank or not? From what I’ve read, that town is very steeped in its racism, so I doubt it was a prank.

No matter where you’re from, please know that the black struggle is universal. And therefore black Americans are “your people”.

Let’s see:

Haiti – A country with no economic structure that depends on its dignity and strength of its people to survive.

Jamaica – A country that largely depends on tourism to survive. .

Africa – A continent that struggles to survive despite its vast resources.

Shall I continue?

All over the world exist black countries that struggle to surivive — so no matter where you come from, you’re one of us, my dear.

You are not comfortable with most black Americans because you’re not comfortable in your own black skin. And this is the self hatred I speak of.

BTW, Why don’t I go to your place of birth with my two bachelors degree and masters degree and belittle “your people” as no good people with no respect for the white man’s language?

Marley, please go find yourself because you’re obviously lost. And stop using the late Great Bob Marley’s name in vain. He believed in unity not that crap you’re spewing on here.

nahnah

No matter where you’re from, please know that the black struggle is universal. And therefore black Americans are “your people”.

…………………….

Sorry- YOU are not “my people” The color of my skin will not be sufficient to put you and I in the same category. I do not practice self hatred. I do however, intensely dislike people like you. I supose you think I am an OREO..lol Keep thinking that while you choke on the dust as I leave you behind. AGAIN

Countries like Jamaica are much too invested in tourism..but those are results of the IMF policies, and not at the heart of how Jamaicans wanted to govern their country. It is too complicated to get into.

Greg, I have no issues with your statements really and I have a great deal of respect for those black Americans who struggled valiantly to oppose a system that did not wish to let them in. These people were proud, and had dignity. They are a dying breed, and I truly wish that were not so. These kind of people are closer to the Caribbean Heart- hardworking, many jobs if necessary, stressing the importance of getting a proper education, not relying on the government, taking care of family, trustworthy in money matters, maintaining a dignified persona and speaking properly, especially outside the home.

Oh NAHNAH- you are not the only one with “degrees.” However, the true indicator of sucess is one’s emotional intelligence. You are obviously quite angry with me, and I don’t care. I doubt quite frankly that Bob Marley would have been all over you. Black Americans were very derisive of Reggae in general.

So stop trying to pull me into your tiny little world. Your struggle is not a struggle that I will take on…no matter what you say.

@Greg

Thank YOU!!

I think there is a intelligent discussion going on here. I know I will sound blunt but I have a problem with these “uppity blacks” that think just because they have their PHD degrees that have “entered” white Academia and they think they are “superior” or “better” then other blacks. Its great that McWhorter has his education and all that but I do believe the reason some people are really angry at this guy is because they can READ BETWEEN THE LINES. I do believe this man has issues with self hated. Its one of the things we as black people don’t talk about enough.

I don’t take McWhorter seriously and yes he is a “House Negro”. Blacks like McWhorter may “think” he’s going against the “grain” but in the eyes of white conservatives he’s just another House Negro.

The white conservative media are actually grateful to have self haters like McWhorter because they “know” he can be used as a “shield” to hide their own bigotry and biases against black people. The Jena Six situation clearly a lot of racism is involved. And I commend all the black people that stood up and said ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. The judicial system is one of the places where the pernicious racism still exists.

McWhorter is entitled to his own opinion as we all are. And yes as a race everyone is NOT going to think the same way. However, its obvious to discern that the mainstream white media USE conservative blacks like McWhorter because he’s basically a “mask” to hide their racism. Its easier for the white media to get conservative blacks like McWhorter to go on TV and “bash” black people because then they can say its not “Racism.”

Greg, I have no issues with your statements really and I have a great deal of respect for those black Americans who struggled valiantly to oppose a system that did not wish to let them in. These people were proud, and had dignity. They are a dying breed, and I truly wish that were not so. These kind of people are closer to the Caribbean Heart- hardworking, many jobs if necessary, stressing the importance of getting a proper education, not relying on the government, taking care of family, trustworthy in money matters, maintaining a dignified persona and speaking properly, especially outside the home

Hello Marley…What you are having trouble understanding is that those qualities you listed above are evident in many black Americans of today. Just like there were good and bad black Americans during the civil rights struggle, the same is true for today. It seems that the media has been successful at ostracizing black Americans when other blacks are putting us down. I didn’t realize that until this past weekend when I was reading coverage of the Jena 6 march in all the major papers and not one of them spoke of the real reason why blacks were marching. It had nothing to with a noose but everything to do with fairness. When the whites were jumping blacks, beating them with beer bottles, pulling guns, nothing was done about it and at most they got probation. Even the so called “Victim” was at the party where the black kid was jumped and before the “victim” was knocked out, he was heard taunting one of the black kids about being beat up at the party. None of the articles I read in the newspaper stated any of that. They kept saying it was about a noose when really, it was about fairness. So now I know the media has an interest in keeping blacks, deaf, dumb and blind and it seems as if that message has carried over across the world to other black and African countries.

To NAHNAH…I like your style. You preached alot of truth and I TOTALLY see where you’re coming from. All you were saying was that blacks around the world, regardless of where you live, have the same issues and instead of putting black Americans down, we should be coming together and making progress hand in hand.

Marley…I understand that Jamaica has been dealt a bad hand by the IMF, the WTO and the lifting of tariffs resulting in a flood of subsidized products from the US, but the fact is there is alot wrong Jamaica too. They don’t even call them ghetto’s over there because that’s too mild a word for what’s going on, they call them slums, The lawlessness and high unemployment. So in spite of the hard working Jamaicans, there is still alot of bad as well…Just like over here in America. We should be coming together instead of staying divided.

Sorry- YOU are not “my people” The color of my skin will not be sufficient to put you and I in the same category. I do not practice self hatred. I do however, intensely dislike people like you. I supose you think I am an OREO..lol Keep thinking that while you choke on the dust as I leave you behind. AGAIN

As I have previously indicated: You are an extremely neurotic person with an immense amount of self-hatred. You attempt to distance yourself from those who allowed you the opportunity to sit here and spew your ignorance.

In terms of ethnicitiy: you are of no different from an African American. Your bad case of denial will cause you to say otherwise, and that’s certainly something you need to work on. As much as I’d love to help you out, the ball is in your court.

Countries like Jamaica are much too invested in tourism..but those are results of the IMF policies, and not at the heart of how Jamaicans wanted to govern their country.

The government of Jamaica has sold it’s country to the British and to a large extent, the United States. Jamaica is a very troubled country with rampant police brutality, homelessness, homophobia, ect. However the government elite fools people into thinking the country is a paradise with blue waters and chocolate covered trees.

I have a great deal of respect for those black Americans who struggled valiantly to oppose a system that did not wish to let them in. These people were proud, and had dignity. They are a dying breed, and I truly wish that were not so. These kind of people are closer to the Caribbean Heart- hardworking, many jobs if necessary, stressing the importance of getting a proper education, not relying on the government, taking care of family, trustworthy in money matters, maintaining a dignified persona and speaking properly, especially outside the home.

Is that why the Caribbean countries are plagued with poverty, violence, unemployment and other economic woes, and so forth and so on? If the Caribbean is such a cute pink heart, why are you here and not there?

However, the true indicator of sucess is one’s emotional intelligence. You are obviously quite angry with me, and I don’t care.

Not angry, just feel very sorry for you – you’re lost.

I doubt quite frankly that Bob Marley would have been all over you. Black Americans were very derisive of Reggae in general.

Are you even a bit capable of being deep? During the Bob Marley days, blacks were at a time of searching for self identity and economic independence. This lead to little little embracement to Marley’s music — something Marley himself talked about many times and expressed concerned about many times.

On the other hand, Marley collaborated with many Black American soul artists during his time.

BTW: The wailers struggled to make it in America until the Island guy caused the band to break up to promote a lighter Bob Marley.

So stop trying to pull me into your tiny little world. Your struggle is not a struggle that I will take on…no matter what you say.

Dear, I would never ask you to join my struggle, as I see your struggle for self identity is enough on your plate for now.

Nah Nah- you silly fool.

Since you don’t know my complete ethnicity, why on earth would you tell me who I am like?

How would you know where I am sitting and writing from. The internet is available OUTSIDE of America you know.

It is very easy to say someone is neurotic and full of self hatred. This (now boring) dialog has gone on for too long, yet not once have I accused YOU of the things you attribute directly to me. When I speak it is in a general way…you just wish to attack people who you think should tow the black party line.

I am weary of your ridiculous personal prattle, and I truly do not care what you think. Nor am I changing my opinion until I see some change from your people.

Its that simple.

PS- Once again. WE are not the same people. SORRY. I know you desperately wish to join my group. WE don’t want you. BTW…those Ivy Leagers you spoke of earlier. I guarantee more than one of them has Caribbean Heritage….I am SO SURE of that….that would make them NOT BA”S….

How do you like them apples?

YOU BORE ME.

Actually, Marley, the word “ghetto” is Italian in origin, and it is an accepted term for an area with a high concentration of a particular ethnic, racial, or social group. Greg makes excellent points about the struggles waged by African Americans that enabled Black people from the Caribbean and Africa to go to places like Harvard. I am Jamaican, so I am quite used to hearing the generalities spouted by Marley and islandgirl. What can I say?

Literati.

I thank you for the clarification on the origin of the word. It makes sense actually.

I have no problem with Greg, and I too think he makes excellent points, and does not personally attack others.

Thank you for being honest about what you know is being said in our households, whether you agree or disagree. We know what life in the Caribbean is really like, and the high expectatons that are drilled into our heads from the time we are little.

Courtesy of Wickipedia:

A ghetto is an area where people from a specific racial or ethnic background live as a group in seclusion, voluntarily or involuntarily. The word was originally used to refer to the Venetian Ghetto in Venice, Italy, where Jews were required to live. The corresponding German term was Judengasse. In Moroccan Arabic, ghettos were called mellah. The term came into widespread use during World War II to refer to Nazi ghettos.

……………………………………….

Judengasse…no huge stretch to know that means Jews Gas

…..

But thank you Literati. I am always willing to open up and learn, but not from people as bullheaded and nasty as NAH NAH- we don’t even speak the same language…lol

Actually, Marley, many Caribbean households also suffer from the absence of high expectations. I believe in the truth, not in stereotypes and national myths. The carnage in Jamaican inner cities is not the product of high expectations; it stems from serious structural problems that are compounded by dysfunctional families and communities. We need to spend more time taking the beams out of our own eyes before we go around trashing African Americans. I have lived in Britain, Canada, the United States, and Brazil, and there are fundamental problems that affect all Black diasporic communities. By the way, many African Americans have mixed ancestry, so telling nahnah that he /she doesn’t know your complete etnicity is neither here nor there. Like many Caribbean people, I have mixed roots (African, European, and Asian) but black identity is more than just a quantifying of blood lines. It’s a medley of historical and cultural experiences that link Harlem, Havana, Port -Au- Prince, Kingston, Bridgetown, Bahia, Lagos and Dakar, etc. into a complex weave of affinities and relationships. To assume the superiority of any of these places and groups is to trade in illusions.

Blessings and peace

That should be “ethnicity”. Sorry for the typo.

Again Marley -

Why are Caribbean countries plagued by violence, poverty, unemployment and other economic woes, police brutality, lack of resources, and such?

Why is that Caribbean countries speak “broken” English and French and don’t use “proper diction” and vocabulary?

@ Marley–

I read some of your posts and although I think you speak (type) eloquently, I beg to differ with you (on some points)

I can honestly understand your perspective about your heritage. However,if you are a male and black and if you are ever in NYC I’d like for you to try any one of the following–

1. Hail a cab in Midtown Manhattan in the evening hours. Note how many will pass you before one actually STOPS!

2. Watch how women will clutch their purse, briefcase or, personal effects closer to them as you approach and pass.

3. Notice how (this is the best one) your change from a purchase is sometimes “placed” on the counter instead of in your hand!

4. If you should visit a department store, take notice of how you’re given “preferred treatment and attention” by the cutsomer service associate(s).

5. In this day and age where check writing has become all but obsolete, if you STILL write them–turn one of your cancelled checks over and examine it v-e-r-y careful. I’m almost positive there is a “code” which someone has written if you are a BM or BF. This is normally done when presenting the check for purchases.

My point is–to some, no matter how well spoken you are, your education, your income potential and or level, at the end of the day YOU ARE BLACK! We are not separated by social status or being–we are almost ALWAYS grouped. And when we are–the outcome or opinion is usually not positive!

Thanks—

Dear 1 True Diva.

Thank you for your well thought out response.

I do know what you are talking about, and I hear you. I find those events wholly unacceptable too. I mean really really offensive.

I am going to clutch my purse too, when I see a group of whites together. I frequently decline to get into an elevator with a “shady looking” white person. I really do get exactly what you are saying BUT I cannot let their nasty behavior dictate how I live my life. They do not have that power over me.

I do hear you though, so thank you…and I know what you mean about the new forum. I liked seeing Wesley Snipes holding up that sign..lol

Marley-

Why are Caribbean countries plagued by violence, poverty, unemployment and other economic woes, police brutality, lack of resources, and such?

Why is that Caribbean countries speak “broken” English and French and don’t use “proper diction” and vocabulary?

NAHNAH- are you obsessed with Marley or what?

Did I not tell you I was finished “speaking” with you. You are a surly aggressive creature. I could address those things, but I am tired of you.

Oh, BTW, Countries don’t speak…people do. The “broken english” you speak of is called Patois. It is a great very expressive language comprised of some of the African Dialects, Irish and Scottish regional languages, French and some Middle Eastern influences too (Many Jamaicans in particular, are of Lebanese or Syrian extraction.)

PS- Ebonics on the other hand…well what can I say. That is just embarassing for you.

Oh what the hell.

Violence:

West Indians are extremely active in their resistance to opression. They literally refused to be enslaved. The most violent “slaves” were left in the Caribbean because they would not be broken. They would not put up with that Sh–. They would rather die. The slaves who were able to be broken were sent to the US. (that did not mean they did not continue to resist, but too many were compliant in a terrible situation…but we don’t really know thank goodness…may they rest well. All I know is the slave masters in the Caribbean lived in mortal fear every day. THEY COULD NOT WIN…or sleep, or maintain slaves in an “alive” condition. As I stated before, they would rather die. In the end, the mostly British “masters” joined with the slaves, and lived very harmoniously. The motto in Jamaica in particular (Thanks Wiki)is “Out of Many One People.” That is not of course the end of the story. Struggles continue for many people.

Slavery was over in the Caribbean many years before it was over in America. …and the Maroons in particular proved to be deadly foes to the British.

Poverty:

Yes there is poverty. This is a wrong thing. Yet many West Indians have dignity even in the midst of extreme poverty and a very hard life. I have not found a sane West Indian who you could not reason with eventually.

Unemployment:

Is there not unemployment in the USA????

The infrastructure due to the IMF and various terrible deals which enriched a few. Further, the islands experienced huge “brain drains” in the 1970′s and 1980′s when it was greatly feared they may have been turning into a communist countries due to close ties with Castro, and proximity to Cuba. The currencies in the islands used to be more valuable than the American dollar, and the US could not take that…and so began the sytematic breakdown of the infrastructureand economies of the islands.

Other Economic Woes:

With unemployment comes other economice woes. There are rich people, a solid middle class, and far too many under the poverty line. Yet education is still emphasized, and the little island Of Jamaica has one of the highest literacy rates in the world. Not to mention its citizens are to be found in virtually every part of the world, in high echelons. They are an extremely proud people, and very tied to their homeland.

Police Brutality:

You really missed the boat here. This is not a concept you will find much in the Caribbean. You are more likely to find Police Corruption. This is something that you will see in many areas of the world. Au contraire, the police are probably afraid of the violence of the people should they brutalize said people. Is it a great thing? Of course not.

Lack of Resources:

I am not sure what resources you are referring to. I would say most people have access to plumbing facilities and clean running water. A human being will need more than these two commodities, of course. In America, many of your “people” don’t have these things either…but they live in the richest country in the world…and they have opportunities they choose to ignore.

And Such”

???????

GOODBYE forever NAH NAH NAH…You can respond if you like. I don’t care. I will not respond again. I mean it this time. You are a nasty creature. I shall not hold my tongue against you anymore.

Return at once to the comfort of your beloved Ghetto. You can whine about people like me all day and night…and study for your next prison degree from your community college..lol

Where I said I have not found a sane West Indian who I could not reason with…I need to flesh that statement out a little more….I am weary, and I don’t feel like typing more to explain myself. I placed that comment in the wrong context too. Oh well, its not Rocket Science…and I am tired of NAH NAH NAH NUTTY.

Sometimes I refer to blacks as “them” because sometimes “they” don’t represent my experiences or views at all. But I still fight for “them” because “they” are always US. Ass.

Why is there so much Jamaican on Jamaican crime in Jamaica?

Why were Jamaicans killing each other during elections?

Why is there even poverty if Jamaicans and other Caribbean countries if they’re supposed to be so above and beyond? Slavery is over, right? Jamaica gained its independence over 40 years ago, so why the GHETTOS, and killings, and homelessness? Are Jamaicans not taking advantage of the opportunities before them? They’re no longer slaves and/or under British rule, right?

Why are so many young Jamaican women selling themselves to tourists?

Why is NAH NAH SUCH AN ASS?

Why IS NAH NAH A STUPID PARROT?

No constructive answer to the question?

I rest my case.

If you can’t attack what a man is actually saying with facts, logic, and rational arguments then just attack him as a person. Very mature.

Marley:

It’s a pity that you feel you have to resort to name calling rather than addressing the very valid points made by nahnah.

@john and Literati

Oh didn’t you know when ‘some’ people get upset because they’ve run out of intelligent things to say they resort to cursing,insults, and belittling.

@ BlahBlah

SPEAK THE TRUTH. I love it.:)

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Marley: It’s good to see that, if you let people keep talking, they will ALWAYS show who they are. Through this discussion, you’ve shown yourself not only to be a (drumroll, please) sellout, but a person that quotes Wikipedia in an attempt to be scholarly. I get it: You ain’t from America and you enjoy holding hands with white men. Good for you.

BTW, nahnah, with his/her “inferior” African-American intelligence, has absolutely COOKED you. It’s good that you won’t touch the keyboard again.

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